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From: temp (
Subject:         Re: My Zinc and Copper yesterday + fairytale ideas on nutrition + questionable high fruit diets
Date: November 15, 2014 at 2:32 am PST

In Reply to: Re: My Zinc and Copper yesterday + fairytale ideas on nutrition + questionable high fruit diets posted by K on November 14, 2014 at 6:35 pm:

Ohh the same Dr. Esselstynís, who believes that total cholesterol is the biological marker for developing heart disease.

This is extremely out-dated 1980s research we are talking about here, we have known for a long time that cholesterol isn't the true culprit in the development of heart disease, which we now know is arterial inflammation. In fact even saturated fats aren't a true factor and they have being completely and unwarrantly villainized by vegan nutritionists.

Over 50% of heart attacks occur in individuals with low or normal cholesterol levels, that alone debunks the myth that total cholesterol is one of the prime biological markers for developing heart disease. In fact its cholesterol which the body releases in response to injury and inflammation.

Which is why high plant based diets are so helpful for reducing the risk of heart disease. Its really not rocket science like i say, put someone on a majority plant based diet and guess what there health will likely improve in a number of ways.

But the main question is, are these diets sustainable and healthy in the long term ? We see clearly that they aren't for most individuals.

TSM summed it up perfectly, whilst alot of their research is promising, its also riddled full of myths and is always heavily manipulated with vegan bias in mind. Show me some 5-10-20+ year plus studies that these diets are still healthy and sustainble ?, ohh wait you probably can't.

These people like T Colin Campbell recommend as you just said COOKED plant based diets, not 100% RAW DIETS like you are purposely trying to mis-represent these individuals research here for your own strict raw vegan beliefs.

Where in any of these guys recommendations do they recommend a 100% strict raw vegan diets based mostly around fruit an such few food groups ?

In fact many of these vegan doctors are against fruit in large amounts or basing the diet around fruit, so again you are misrepresenting the point the. The diet these guys promote contains a much wider range of food groups than your typical Doug Graham 80/10/10 or 30BAD diet.

You say im making unsubstantiated claims, come on K, thats all you've done in the past few posts. You claim that no level of animal foods is healthy, which we know is more myths, as there is plenty of research on the health benefits of diets containing animal foods. Just look at all the vegetarian research done to date, of which there is about 10 times more long term positive studies than there is on any strict raw vegan diet.

You claim we shouldn't eat nuts because these doctors say we should eat seeds instead, as nuts are bad for heart health. Which is again more lies from these people and dangerous as nuts have alot of solid research on their ability to reduce the risk of cardiovascular disease. I suggest you do a quick google search on almonds and heart disease study, to see how wrong you are.

I can back up all my points, whilst some of you guys can back up very few of your often wild beliefs.

There is so many heart supportive nutrients that have the potential to be low on a strict vegetarian diet long term as we are told from the scientific research, some include co-enzyme q10, vitamin B12, omega-3 fatty acids such as DHA, l-carnitine and so on.

Wasn't it Bill Clinton who went on a strict vegan diet under the recommendations of people like Dr. Esselstyn to help improve his heart problems and how long was it before Bill Clinton was needing to add fish back to his diet ?

Yeah not long, just like 99% of the other people who try these strict vegan diets.

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